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    Voices: Independent readers say Keir Starmer needs ‘time and space to clean out the Tories’ from government

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseMy recent work focusing on Latino voters in Arizona has shown me how crucial independent journalism is in giving voice to underrepresented communities.Your support is what allows us to tell these stories, bringing attention to the issues that are often overlooked. Without your contributions, these voices might not be heard.Every dollar you give helps us continue to shine a light on these critical issues in the run up to the election and beyondEric GarciaWashington Bureau ChiefIn Liverpool this week Sir Keir Starmer had his first opportunity to address a Labour conference as prime minister, giving the leader a chance to take stock of his government’s performance since sweeping to power in July.The prime minister set out his vision for the future of Britain under Labour, and his determination to rebuild the nation, while facing down criticism for means-testing winter fuel payments.He has faced criticism for accepting freebies including clothes and glasses – though our chief political commentator John Rentoul says those jeering him are playing into the hands of the right-wing media and those trying to dissuade a new breed of politician from Westminster.When we asked for your early assessments of Keir Starmer’s tenure as prime minister, the comments revealed hope for the future – with calls to address areas such as wealth inequality, repair public services and create closer links with the EU.Here’s what you had to say:‘Progress in the right direction’In the hurricane of dissent from the right-wing media, which one might expect, Labour are making progress in the right direction generally.But, they must read the zeitgeist better and show some signs of addressing the catastrophic wealth inequality in Britain. Tax the rich and feed the poor and we are all better off.silverbusInherited messThe freebies coverage hasn’t changed my opinion of Labour. I feel that the stories did far more and if Labour are staying within the rules, I can’t help thinking it’s just the Tory press making a smear out of nothing.I do think the doom and gloom was a bit heavy-footed but I also can see that they’ve been making enormous changes against the massive odds of the mess they inherited. The swift action against the rioters was decisive. They’re bringing the arts back into the curriculum. I really think they’re going to turn the country around.Val‘Give them 14 years’Recent events have not impacted my opinion of Starmer and his government whatsoever. The election was on the 4th July which is not even three months ago and the task facing the government is huge. The impact of their policies will be seen over a period of years not weeks.People tend to have very short memories with the chaos of the Tories fading into the past, but their legacy will not be cleared up with a newspaper headline, a party conference or even the first budget. We complain about the ‘short-termism’ of politicians acting to gain or keep votes every few years, and yet it seems we’re happy to dismiss this government after a matter of weeks. Give them 14 years and see how things are then!ColwynDay‘Higher bar’ for means-tested fuel allowanceI’m a fortunate, well-off woman in a relationship with another well-off retired professional. Both have good occupational pensions, live in a well-insulated home with an air source heat pump, in a prosperous rural Yorkshire village where 95 per cent plus own their own homes and are similarly placed. I certainly don’t need or want a winter fuel allowance.That said, I think a means-tested solution should have a far higher bar. People dependent solely on the lowest state pension in Europe, are more likely to live in cold, drafty rented accommodation. Inequality in UK is a killer and this policy as it stands will impact on the poorest, least healthy section of the population.CalamityJane‘Dealing with the impossible’Good start dealing with the impossible. Miracles take a bit longer.It takes a long time to clean up an inherited mess. They have done well so far.gustifer‘Rush to judgment’There’s a lot of ‘rush to judgment’ going on around here.Tories = 14 years of doing nothing except buffoonery (Johnson, Rees-Mogg) idiocy (Truss, Dorries) unenlightened self interest and making things worse (plenty of data to support that if you can be bothered to look)Labour = less than three months which in political terms is no time to make any noticeable difference.I suspect the negativity below is mostly Tory Tribalism and Reform Contraryism, even from some who claim to have voted for Labour.All that said, I don’t agree with removing the winter fuel allowance from most pensioners which I think was a very clumsy act politically and very harsh on those pensioners who clearly need it.As it goes I’m a pensioner who doesn’t need it (more by luck than judgement and a fairly generous final salary pension) so I’ve no problem they took it from me.Just to be clear I’m a floating voter who voted Labour this time because all the data was very unflattering to the Tories and too many of them struck me as being unserious, out of touch and borderline venal.As for Reform – far too right-wing for my tastes and Farage is the worst kind of plausible sophist entirely lacking substance and full of special pleading his case.I won’t score Labour until the end of this term of government. Then I’ll score them at the ballot box, purely based on the data.WokeUp‘Get on with the job’The main thing they need to do is shut up about the Conservatives and get on with the job. They need to be more positive and back this up with policies that encourage growth and investment. Changes that help families and young people should also be at the top of the list.theculture‘It will take more than a few weeks’Obviously, I am extremely unhappy about the winter fuel allowance debacle, because I know several elderly pensioners who are just over the pension credit limit and will suffer. Continuing the move from working tax credit to universal credit has already hit me because I can no longer claim my £24 a week. Not much to some, but it went a long way towards my food.As for the rest, well, I shall give my thoughts when they have been in longer. It will take more than a few weeks to sort the mess that the Tories left behind.MsRuthless‘The direction of travel is good’They have been politically inept, in my view. Means-testing winter fuel should have targeted only the well-off. If the right-wing media can point to a dead pensioner that they can blame on Labour, we won’t hear the last of it. But the direction of travel is good; repair the public services and trade relations with Europe, take those privatised utilities in hand. They’re fortunate there’s plenty of time to improve.Longmemory23‘Little creativity’I was optimistic when Labour won the election, it was a move away from the far left of the party and Starmer seemed highly qualified for the role. I wasn’t thrilled about the policies and the manifesto was vague, but the message of change was their main campaigning point and change is exactly what the country needs.However, after a few months, despite what the government says, it seems like change is not really on the agenda. It is more of the same and unfortunately, I’m not surprised. There seems to be very little creativity in the few solutions offered and the vagary is ongoing. Overall the approach is quite wishy-washy which rather suits Starmer’s disposition.Regardless, I am withholding strong judgment until next election cycle when we will see if their policies have actually made a difference. I won’t be holding my breath.JimboJones‘Political naivety’It seems to me that it was gross political naivety for the Labour government to make the first public service cut to pensioners’ income. While I’ve always felt a bit guilty as a pensioner taking the winter fuel allowance – I am reasonably comfortably off with a work pension as well as the state pension – I do feel for those who only get the state pension, I don’t think I could live off it.As for the freebies scandal, I don’t know how the Tory press has the nerve to condemn Starmer after all the money the Tories have leached out of public funds for their cronies, never mind private donations – the PPS scandal during lockdown comes to mind.Gingerbred‘I still have hope’They are clearly more competent and well-intentioned than the last rabble, but the winter fuel debacle does feel like an unnecessary, unforced error and the ‘freebies’ farrago is just a bit politically naive. Ultimately, they have misread the need for a) a more hopeful strategic story and b) the need to get out there day in and day out to shape the short-term narrative.If they can learn from those mistakes, I still have hope for the next five years. But if they don’t, they won’t get a second term. In particular, regarding the winter fuel payment, they should find a way to defer or remove poorer pensioners from the hit.Ned76‘Time and space’It s very early days, far too early to judge. I’ve liked some of what I’ve heard from some ministers. But I am disappointed with other elements, like the expenses ‘same old’.But I’m prepared to give them time and space to clean out the Tories’ Augean Stables and then see where they get to, what they manage to achieve. Of course, this version of Labour will not be to everyone’s taste (not sure it’s to mine, TBH) but Jeez Louise, it’s way better than the alternative.Lysistrata1Some of the comments have been edited for this article. You can read the full discussion in the comments section of the original article here.All you have to do is sign up, submit your question and register your details – then you can then take part in the discussion. You can also sign up by clicking ‘log in’ on the top right-hand corner of the screen.Make sure you adhere to our community guidelines, which can be found here. For a full guide on how to comment click here. More

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    Rachel Reeves could scrap non-dom tax raid, reports suggest

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseOur mission is to deliver unbiased, fact-based reporting that holds power to account and exposes the truth.Whether $5 or $50, every contribution counts.Support us to deliver journalism without an agenda.Louise ThomasEditorRachel Reeves could water down her planned raid on nom-doms amid fears the move would fail to raise any money, according to reports.The chancellor had hoped to raise about £1bn a year by cracking down on the tax perk available to wealthy foreigners living in the UK.But there are concerns that those affected could simply leave the country, meaning the move would fail to generate any income for the government.The proposal was part of Labour’s manifesto ahead of July’s election, but officials said Ms Reeves could overhaul the plan ahead of her 30 October Budget if the numbers did not add up.One told the Financial Times: “We will be pragmatic, not ideological. We won’t press on regardless, but we are not going to abandon this completely.”The term “non-domicile” describes a UK resident whose permanent home – or domicile – for tax purposes is outside Britain – meaning they only pay money on earnings made in the UK.A Treasury spokesperson called the report “speculation, not Government policy” and pledged to remove “the outdated non-dom tax regime”.One of the most well-known non-doms is former prime minister Rishi Sunak’s wife, Akshata Murty, who was embroiled in convtoversy during Mr Sunak’s time in office More

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    Russell Findlay elected as leader of the Scottish Conservatives following bitter contest

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseOur mission is to deliver unbiased, fact-based reporting that holds power to account and exposes the truth.Whether $5 or $50, every contribution counts.Support us to deliver journalism without an agenda.Louise ThomasEditorRussell Findlay has been elected as the new leader of the Scottish Conservatives after winning a majority of votes in the first round.Mr Findlay secured a clear victory with 62 per cent of the vote, with Murdo Fraser coming second and Meghan Gallacher third.He called for the party to “come together as one united team”, as the Scottish Conservatives look to bounce back from their worst UK general election result since 2005.The Scottish Conservatives saw their vote share halved since the 2019 general election, when Jackson Carlaw ran the party.Murdo Fraser, left, came second while Meghan Gallacher, centre, came third More

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    Keir Starmer admits making Israeli hostages ‘sausages’ gaffe

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseOur mission is to deliver unbiased, fact-based reporting that holds power to account and exposes the truth.Whether $5 or $50, every contribution counts.Support us to deliver journalism without an agenda.Louise ThomasEditorSir Keir Starmer admitted he mangled his words when referring to Israeli hostages as “sausages” during his Labour conference speech this week.When asked about the blunder, Sir Keir said he was prepared to be ribbed over the gaffe which was ridiculed across social media.“I just mangled the beginning of the word,” he admitted. “These things are there to give you all the opportunity to rib me.”The prime minister butchered a call for Hamas to release Israeli hostages still held in Gaza, instead demanding the “return of the sausages” before swiftly correcting himself.“I call again for restraint and de-escalation at the border between Lebanon and Israel. I call again for all parties to step back from the brink. I call again for all parties to step back from the brink,” he said.Sir Keir made the embarrassing blunder at the Labour Party conference in Liverpool on Tuesday More

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    Trump heaps praise on ‘very popular’ Keir Starmer as pair meet in New York

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseAs your White House correspondent, I ask the tough questions and seek the answers that matter.Your support enables me to be in the room, pressing for transparency and accountability. Without your contributions, we wouldn’t have the resources to challenge those in power.Your donation makes it possible for us to keep doing this important work, keeping you informed every step of the way to the November electionAndrew FeinbergWhite House CorrespondentSir Keir Starmer met with Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump on Thursday after the former president described him as “very nice”.The prime minister visited Trump Tower in New York ahead of November’s US election as he visited the United States for the United Nations General Assembly.Foreign secretary David Lammy, who called Mr Trump a “racist KKK and Nazi sympathiser” seven years ago, also attended the talks.Ahead of the meeting, Sir Keir said: “It’ll be really good to establish a relationship between the two of us. I’m a great believer in personal relations on the international stage.“I think it really matters that you know who your counterpart is in any given country, and know them personally, get to know them face to face.”Sir Keir Starmer met with former president Donald Trump during his visit to New York for the United Nations General Assembly More

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    Your Labour Party conference questions answered by John Rentoul as Keir Starmer pledges to ‘face the storm’

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseOur mission is to deliver unbiased, fact-based reporting that holds power to account and exposes the truth.Whether $5 or $50, every contribution counts.Support us to deliver journalism without an agenda.Louise ThomasEditorI’ve been responding to your questions following a significant week for Labour, as they held their first conference in government in over a decade.Sir Keir Starmer steadied his party on Tuesday in a keynote speech, reminding of Labour’s mandate to reshape Britain with a simple message: “We won.” The prime minister pledged to “face the storm” of unpopular decisions and declared “we’re all in this together” at the party’s annual conference in Liverpool.Amid criticism over winter fuel payment cuts, gifts, and tensions in Downing Street, Sir Keir sought to silence doubters with a long-term vision. He promised “homes for heroes” for veterans, unveiled a Hillsborough Law to tackle cover-ups, and his justice secretary vowed to reduce the number of women in prison.As the conference unveiled more of Labour’s platform and policy positions ahead of the upcoming budget, it was only natural that our readers had questions.Here are six questions from Independent readers – and my answers from the “Ask Me Anything” event.Q: Why is everyone obsessed with “the first 100 days” and do you think the gap between forming a government and the first Budget has been the big problem?TimCA: I agree that the obsession with “100 days” is an irritating journalistic device, but we humans like round numbers. You make a good point about the lateness of the Budget: I think it would have been better to have an early emergency Budget in July and got the pain out of the way in one go. Part of the thinking was presumably the need to give the Office for Budget Responsibility 10 weeks’ notice – after criticising Liz Truss for ignoring the OBR, Rachel Reeves obviously wanted to play it by the book (but possibly could still have had a Budget in September?).Q: Shouldn’t we give labour (I didn’t vote them in) a little while to sort out the dog’s breakfast that the Tories have left us with?WaitWhatA: I think most people are prepared to give Labour time to sort out the problems they have inherited. They have settled some strikes, but without securing changes in working practices.But the acceptance of gifts has struck home with a lot of people, especially with pensioners who are just above pension credit level.Q: Where are the tax reforms aimed at closing loopholes and preventing tax avoidance by wealthy high earners? What tangible benefits are being provided for low-income individuals? Additionally, where is the promised review of employment laws addressing zero-hour contracts and workplace bullying?WorkerA: The tax changes will be announced in the Budget, and Keir Starmer hinted in his speech that they will fall on the better off. He said: “The cost of filling that black hole in our public finances, that will be shared fairly.” I am not sure why the winter fuel payment cut was announced so much earlier.As for the employment rights measures, Angela Rayner promised the bill would be published when parliament resumes in a couple of weeks’ time, although not all the detail will be decided until later. It seems reasonable to take some time to get it right – although I think Labour should have done more work on these policies in opposition.Q: No mention of climate change which is getting exponentially worse and will consume more and more of our national resources. It is also an opportunity for industry (flood resilience, food resilience, renewable energy, EV) Where will Labour go on all this?JPCoetzeeA: Keir Starmer mentioned “climate change” three times in his speech, but each time only as an item in a list of things that the government has to attend to. But Ed Miliband delivered a substantial speech yesterday – you can find a copy on the Labour Party website.Q: Now that the Labour Party has taken away the winter fuel allowance do they still subscribe to the statements they made back when the Tories wanted to do that and Labour said 4,000 people would die? What has changed, maybe mild winters?DaleelA: I think the Labour Party would say that it is a changed party, and the 4,000 figure was produced when Jeremy Corbyn was leader.Q: According to Starmer We should ‘respect the ballot box’, but under our corrupt system, Starmer is wielding his ‘majority’ on the 24 per cent Labour vote. The majority of British people abstained or voted against Labour. How is this fair?will121A: I am not in favour of compulsory voting. If people don’t want to vote, that’s up to them. Their abstention cannot then be used to make an argument about the democratic legitimacy about the process that took place without them.But I’m not in favour of proportional representation either. Our system is easy to understand and I think most people got the result they wanted.These questions and answers were part of an ‘Ask Me Anything’ hosted by John Rentoul at 4pm BST on Tuesday 24 September. Some of the questions and answers have been edited for this article. You can read the full discussion in the comments section of the original article.John also sends a weekly Commons Confidential newsletter exclusive to Independent Premium subscribers, taking you behind the curtain of Westminster. If this sounds like something you would be interested in, head here to find out more. More

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    Starmer saved by Tory leadership chaos in Labour poll slide over freebies row

    Your support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseOur mission is to deliver unbiased, fact-based reporting that holds power to account and exposes the truth.Whether $5 or $50, every contribution counts.Support us to deliver journalism without an agenda.Louise ThomasEditorLabour’s standing with the public is holding firm despite a barrage of criticism for Keir Starmer and senior ministers over freebies, his chief of staff Sue Gray and unpopular policy decisions.The weekly Techne UK tracker poll reveals that after a difficult conference in Liverpool for Labour – overshadowed by questions about the prime minister’s integrity and infighting – the party is still at 32 per cent, down just one point.Meanwhile the Tories, who go into their conference in disarray without a leader and overshadowed by the resignation of former chair Baroness Warsi, have failed to capitalise on Labour’s woes – going up just one point to 22 per cent.Nigel Farage’s Reform are still challenging the Tories at 18 per cent, with the Lib Dems at 13 per cent and the Greens at 7 per cent – all unchanged.Starmer has faced criticism but is not suffering yet in the public’s verdict More

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    Keir Starmer UN speech – live: PM meets with Donald Trump for first time at two-hour dinner

    Keir Starmer refuses to apologise to pensioners over winter fuel payment cutsYour support helps us to tell the storyFind out moreCloseMy recent work focusing on Latino voters in Arizona has shown me how crucial independent journalism is in giving voice to underrepresented communities.Your support is what allows us to tell these stories, bringing attention to the issues that are often overlooked. Without your contributions, these voices might not be heard.Every dollar you give helps us continue to shine a light on these critical issues in the run up to the election and beyondEric GarciaWashington Bureau ChiefSir Keir Starmer met Donald Trump for the first time as the two men sat down for a two-hour dinner meeting in New York on Thursday night.The PM and Foreign Secretary David Lammy met with the former president before flying back to the UK.Topics discussed included the importance of retaining the close partnership between the UK & US, according to Downing Street.Earlier, speaking at the United Nations General Assembly, the prime minister urged Israel and Hezbollah to agree a ceasefire and for the two sides to “step back from the brink”.In a speech to world leaders in New York, Sir Keir said: “I call on Israel and Hezbollah: Stop the violence, step back from the brink.”The 79th UN summit comes as the Middle East teeters on the brink of all-out conflict and the bloody war in Ukraine grinds on.It follows an intervention at the UN Security Council where he tore into Russia over its actions in Ukraine, saying Vladimir Putin was treating his own citizens as “bits of meat to fling into the grinder” in the conflict.Show latest update 1727404200What was announced in Starmer’s Labour conference speech?Sir Keir Starmer’s address to the 2024 Labour Party Conference saw him promise to rebuild Britain “brick by brick” after fourteen years of Tory government, telling conference delegates his government will create a “Britain that belongs to you”.But what exactly was announced? We look at the key developments from the prime minister’s speech below.Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 03:301727402439Starmer wraps up 2-hour dinner with Donald TrumpSir Keir Starmer has finished a two-hour dinner meeting with Donald Trump in New York, according to reports.The PM and Foreign Secretary David Lammy met with the former president before flying back to the UK.Topics discussed included the importance of retaining the close partnership between the UK & US, according to Downing Street.Graeme Massie27 September 2024 03:001727402400Sir Keir Starmer says he wants to “reset” the UK’s relationship with the EU.Sir Keir Starmer will visit Brussels as he steps up efforts to “reset” the UK’s relationship with the European Union.The Prime Minister wants to repair the damage caused by years of Brexit wrangling in an effort to boost trade and security co-operation.European Commission chief Ursula von der Leyen revealed that Sir Keir would visit Brussels next week after the pair met in New York.Sir Keir has met a string of EU leaders since taking office and has spoken about his “ambitious” plans for a new relationship.Sir Keir said: “I want to reset our relationship with the EU and make Brexit work for the British people.”He said he was “looking forward to visiting Brussels next week to start discussions” with the commission president.Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 03:001727400600Tory leadership candidate Labour most fears revealedSenior aids have revealed that Labour wants to “avoid” James Cleverly as future Tory leader.According to the i newspaper, Downing Street officials said it was the former home secretary who they would least like to win the contest.A Labour party figure said: “I think Cleverly could be a problem. He sounds quite reasonable,” a No 10 aide added: “James Cleverly – that’s who we want to avoid.”Another government aide said Kemi Badenoch does not represent a threat as the party is “not sure she’d take our votes”.Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 02:301727398800£10bn data centre investment shows UK ‘open for business’, says StarmerA £10 billion US investment in a new artificial intelligence data centre will create 4,000 jobs in the UK, the government has announced.The deal with private equity giant Blackstone will create Europe’s biggest AI data centre in Blyth, Northumberland.You can read the full story below:Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 02:001727397000POLITICS EXPLAINED | Can Starmer ignore his Labour conference defeat on fuel payments?Rank-and-file members at conference – Labour’s supreme policy-making body – have voted against the government’s decision to means-test pensioners’ winter fuel payments. John Rentoul explains why the cuts will go ahead regardless:Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 01:301727395200Starmer’s Covid broadcast urging work from home recorded in donor’s £18m penthouseSir Keir Starmer recorded a Covid-era broadcast urging the public to work from home from a Labour donor’s £18 million penthouse.The Christmas message, broadcast in December 2021, was reportedly filmed at a flat belonging to Lord Waheed Alli – a donor who has handed hundreds of thousands of pounds to the Labour Party over the last two decades.It came five days after the previous Conservative government presided over new guidance to limit the spread of a new Covid-19 variant, including recommendations to work from home when possible.Our political correspondent Millie Cooke has the full story:Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 01:001727393400Fewer pupils out of school at start of academic year as absence fines riseThe number of pupils in England off school without permission at the start of the academic year has fallen slightly compared with last year, figures suggest.Data from the Department for Education (DfE) shows the unauthorised absence rate across all schools in England was 2.0% in the week ending September 13, compared with 2.1% in the equivalent week in 2023.It comes as parents in England face higher fines if they take their children out of class without permission this academic year as part of a government drive to boost attendance since the Covid-19 pandemic.School absence fines have increased from £60 to £80 under the changes, and a parent who receives a second fine for the same child within a three-year period will automatically receive a £160 fine.The DfE has said other actions, such as a parenting order or prosecution, will be considered if a parent exceeds two fines per child within a three-year period, and those who are prosecuted could receive a fine of up to £2,500.In the last week of the summer term – the week ending July 19 – the unauthorised absence rate was 5.0%, which was lower than at the end of the academic year in 2023 when the rate was 5.6%.Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 00:301727391600Pensioners in legal action against governments over winter fuel payment cutTwo pensioners are seeking to take the Scottish and UK governments to court over the cut to the winter fuel payment.Peter and Florence Fanning, of Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire, have raised proceedings with the help of the Govan Law Centre against the Scottish government and the UK Work and Pensions Secretary over the policy.Following Labour’s election win, Chancellor Rachel Reeves announced the winter fuel payment – which had previously been universal – will only be available to those on pension credit or other means-tested benefits this year due to financial woes.The decision led to the Scottish government – which was due to take control over a similar payment through the devolved Social Security Scotland but has since announced a delay – to follow suit.The judicial review – which has been raised at the Court of Session – now requires a judge’s approval to move to a hearing on the merits, with the Govan Law Centre seeking to expedite both the case and its application for legal aid to ensure a decision can be handed down before the winter.The case asks the court to rule on whether the decision was unlawful, which would then allow the petitioners to ask the court to, in effect, set aside the policy and restore the winter fuel payment to all.Speaking at a press conference in Edinburgh on Thursday, Mr Fanning, 73, said: “We intend to sue both the London and Scottish governments, since both are guilty through action and inaction, of damaging the welfare of pensioners.“We are hoping to be successful, given the manifest injustice involved, however, my work as a trade unionist and shop steward has taught me that some battles are worth fighting regardless of the outcome – I believe this is one such battle.”Salma Ouaguira27 September 2024 00:001727390792‘I have to be nice’ Donald Trump ahead of New York meeting with Sir KeirAsked by GB News what he thought of Sir Keir Starmer, Trump replied: “Well I’m going to see him in about an hour so I have to be nice.” “I actually think he’s very nice. He ran a great race, he did very well, it’s very early he’s very popular.”Ahead of the meeting, Sir Keir told reporters: “I think it really matters that you know who your counterpart is in any given country, and know them personally, get to know them face to face.”Barney Davis26 September 2024 23:46 More